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Deep Thoughts About Stupid Sh*t: A Pop-Culture Podcast
Ever had something you love dismissed because it’s “just” pop culture? What others might deem stupid shit, you know matters. You know it’s worth talking and thinking about. So do we. We're Tracie and Emily, two sisters who think a lot about a lot of things. From Twilight to Ghostbusters, Harry Potter to the Muppets, and wherever pop culture takes us, come overthink with us as we delve into our deep thoughts about stupid shit.
Deep Thoughts About Stupid Sh*t: A Pop-Culture Podcast
The Truman Show: Deep Thoughts About Narcissism, Product Placement, and Parasocial Pop Culture
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Peter Weir's 1998 film The Truman Show, based on a screenplay by Andrew Niccol and starring Jim Carrey, was praised for its pop culture prescience because it came out just before the explosion of reality television. But as Emily argues on this episode, that cultural commentary misses the point. Reality TV may be the storytelling backdrop of The Truman Show, but the fantasy world that Ed Harris's Christof creates for Truman without his knowledge or consent gets to a deeper social and cultural issue than having cameras everywhere. This film offers a pop culture allegory for abusive control that calls itself love--to the point where many who have escaped from high control religions see themselves in Truman. (Also, product placement is never seamless!)
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Mentioned in this episode:
What The Truman Show Reveals About Its Characters
The Truman Show, Mormonism, and the Philosophy of Questioning
When Does Truman Figure It Out?
This episode was edited by Resonate Recordings.
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We are Tracie Guy-Decker and Emily Guy Birken, known to our family as the Guy Girls.
We have super-serious day jobs. For the bona fides, visit our individual websites: tracieguydecker.com and emilyguybirken.com
We're hella smart and completely unashamed of our overthinking prowess. We love movies and tv, science fiction, comedy, and murder mysteries, good storytelling with lots of dramatic irony, and analyzing pop culture for gender dynamics, psychology, sociology, and whatever else we find.
What I took away from this was not the cameras and all of that. It was the gaslighting, the manipulation, Christoph's narcissism, the lack of choice, the lack of consent. That is what left me feeling cold about this film.
Speaker 2:Have you ever had something you love dismissed because it's just pop culture, what others might deem stupid shit? You know matters, you know what's worth talking and thinking about, and so do we. So come overthink with us as we delve into our deep thoughts about stupid shit.
Speaker 1:I'm Emily Guy-Burken and you're listening to Deep Thoughts About Stupid Shit, because pop culture is still culture, and shouldn't you know what's in your head? On today's episode, I'll be sharing my deep thoughts about the 1998 film, the Truman Show, with my sister, tracy Guy-Decker, and with you. Let's dive in. Okay, trace, I didn't know until yesterday whether or not you'd seen this film, because it came out after we'd both kind of left the nest. But tell me what you remember, what you know about this movie.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I definitely have seen it. I have a number of like Polaroids, like vignettes in my head about this film. Like I remember good morning and, if I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening and good night. I remember clearly that, like Truman's, the wedding photo, like his wife is like holding, like crossing her fingers behind her back or something, because all the people he's the only one who's not an actor, you know and him sort of figuring that out and kind of being released from that out and kind of being released from that. And I remember, I very clearly remember a moment where what? Like his best friend, like he's not where they think he is, and he looks straight into the camera and is like I don't know what to do and like breaks the illusion and everybody's mad at him or the people in charge are mad at him.
Speaker 2:I remember that a girlfriend or a would-be girlfriend, is like wearing a button that says how will it end? Which actually about him, but he doesn't realize it that his dad supposedly died because the actor stopped wanting to play along and then he sees him on the street or something as an extra. I remember it being like both amusing and deeply, deeply disturbing. Remember it being like both amusing and deeply, deeply disturbing. That's sort of the like flavor that's in my brain about the Truman Show. Tell me, why are we? Why are we talking about it today?
Speaker 1:I'm not sure. I can't remember what reminded me of it recently, but I wanted to revisit this film that I saw in the theater, I think twice, when it came out, and then saw a couple more times after that, and I remember really liking it, finding it very thought-provoking, and then I hadn't really thought about it again until the last five or ten years. One of my interests is I find the stories of people who have escaped high-control religions to be very interesting, and I learned that apostates who have escaped these evangelical or other high-control religions see themselves in the Truman Show and that I found fascinating and had not occurred to me. But as soon as I heard that, I was like, of course they do, and so I wanted to rewatch it with that in mind, and so that was you know why it was on the list. So I'm not sure why specifically this week. So that's why, you know, I wanted to rewatch it. And seeing it again for the first time, probably in about 15, 20 years, boy, was it even more disturbing than it was when I saw it as a 19-year-old in the theater. You know, I certainly got disturbing aspects of it at the time and it was heartbreaking, heartbreaking, but this time around I was much more horrified and a lot less charmed than I was seeing it the first time and I also was a lot less convinced by the arguments. There were a lot of people who were saying like, oh my goodness, andrew Nichol, who wrote it, and Peter Weir, who was the director, were prescient because you know, they saw the rise of reality TV and I remember seeing that in the years afterwards like, oh, that's, you know, they saw Survivor and Big Brother coming and you know like, yeah, okay, I see that. And now I'm like, yeah, that misses the point. That misses the point. I don't really feel like that is the point of what this story is about and what it really gets to. That is the human condition that doesn't need the kind of surveillance and cameras. The specific reality television aspect of it that's what's going on in my head about this. And then the religious allegories within this I think are really fascinating and really interesting, that are just so high concept that I know I did not entirely catch as a teenager seeing this. So that's kind of just high level where I'm going. So let me give you, since you only kind of remember those little details, let me give you I'm going to do high level as much as I can.
Speaker 1:Synopsis of the plot. So the Truman Show it's starring Jim Carrey as Truman Burbank. It is a completely immersive reality television show. Jim Carrey is Truman Burbank. He was the first child to be adopted by a corporation. He was one of five unwanted pregnancies and he became the child star because he was born first and so he was adopted by the corporation. The showrunner and director and mastermind behind this is Christoph, played by Ed Harris, kristoff, played by Ed Harris. They have built a huge dome behind the Hollywood Hills in Burbank, which is where Truman's last name comes from. In that dome they have created this island town called Sea Haven, which is actually it's a planned community in Florida and the actual house that Truman lives in was Matt Gates's house. So he's the really awful senator with the huge forehead who oh, oh, the inappropriate things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that guy, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 1:It was a real planned community, so it looks the part of the type of place that they would make.
Speaker 2:So that's not a soundstage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, weird. And so they have scripted his entire life. So Kristoff says like, oh, it's all real, because Truman is real. Yes, everyone around him are actors, but everything he does is real. He doesn't know that this is a creation. They cast a woman to play his mother, they cast a woman to play his mother, they cast a man to play his father and they then allow him to do whatever. At the beginning of the film. We are on day 10,900 and something, so it's been about 30 years, something. So it's been about 30 years. And Truman is married to Meryl, who is played by Laura Linney. Now, meryl is her character's name. The actress is named Hannah Gill and this is something I remember that really bothered me as a 19-year-old, because she's an actress who actually has sex With Truman and it's very clear that Hannah Gill, the actress, cannot stand Truman the person and props to Laura Linney For Making that clear.
Speaker 2:Like, conveying that? Yeah, she conveys.
Speaker 1:How much she doesn't like him. So we get to see like we mostly follow Truman through the film, but we do sometimes see like views with Kristoff, like behind the scenes with the main actors, so with Angela is the name of his mother in the show. I don't know if we find out what the actress's name is. She's played by Holland Taylor. Kirk is the name of his father. I cannot remember what the actor's name is and I don't know what his name is off the show. Marlon is his best friend. He was cast at age seven to be his best friend and has grown up with him and he's played by Noah Emmerich. And one of the things that I think is fascinating about this film is that all of the characters, the main characters in the show, have like classic Hollywood names, so like Marlon Brando, meryl Streep, Kirk Douglas, angela Lansbury, and then the names of the streets are like classic Hollywood names, so like Lancaster. I can't remember them, but they're all like nods to old Hollywood.
Speaker 2:Like actors' last names.
Speaker 1:Yes, so we see some behind the scenes stuff and hear Kristoff talking about like yeah, we did have to put some things in place to keep Truman here. So we see that when he was a child in school, he said I want to be an explorer when I grow up. And his teacher pulls a map down and says you're too late, everything's already been discovered, everything's already been discovered. And there's a point where his mom is looking at old photographs with him and like, oh, here's when we went on vacation to see mount rushmore. And he's like you look small. And she's because it's clearly a soundstage. And she's like, oh, and you slept and slept on that trip. So, like they never actually left the soundstage, they just had him take a nap and said like, oh, you slept all the way.
Speaker 1:They checked him yeah, they had him become an insurance salesman. And they are talking about how dangerous flying is. And when he was seven years old, they wrote into the show that he went sailing with his father and because of this dome that they have, they can control the weather. They made a storm and he insisted on staying out in the storm and his father drowned, which he feels is his fault.
Speaker 2:So it's not just that his dad was dead that I remember, but that he actually feels personally responsible for it and has a phobia of the water to keep him there on this Sea.
Speaker 1:Haven Island.
Speaker 2:On this island.
Speaker 1:And when he was like around high school or college age, they cast Meryl to be his girlfriend, then wife. But he sees and is immediately infatuated with an extra played by Natasha Mechelon. Her name on the show is Lauren, but her actual name is Sylvia and he keeps running into her. She has that pin. How?
Speaker 2:will it end?
Speaker 1:yeah, and he.
Speaker 1:One night they sent her to yeah, one night he manages to like evade cameras because she knows where they are and go to the beach and they kiss and they send another extra, claiming to be her father, telling him she has schizophrenia. She does this with all of her boyfriends and she's like saying no, no, he's lying. He's lying, you're on tv. And the father says we're moving to fiji, you'll never see her again. So from that point on he's obsessed with fiji. So when we meet him at the beginning, we see, see him go through a normal day. He talks to himself in the mirror. There's a camera in the mirror in his bathroom. He says hello to his neighbors and he says good morning and, if I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening and good night, all of that. But as he's getting into his car to drive to work, a light falls from the sky. He goes and looks at it and he's really like what the heck? But then, as he's driving, classical Clive, the DJ on the radio he listens to, explains it away as a plane flying overhead was in trouble and started spewing parts. And you know, that's why you shouldn't fly, because it's so dangerous.
Speaker 1:We see him go through basically a normal day. He has this boring job. He's clearly dissatisfied in it. People like come up to him and like push him against a wall where there's a billboard because it's product placement, that's how the show is paid for. In the evening he goes and hangs out with Marlon. He ends up sitting on the beach just kind of looking out over the water and it starts to rain. But it's just raining over him because the Kristoff wants him to go home, because they want him to have a baby with Meryl, so it's just raining over him. So he doesn't realize at first he just walks out and he's like wait a minute, the water's just over me. And then the water moves, so it's just over him again, and then he starts walking around with it and then it starts raining everywhere. So strange things start to happen as he starts being spontaneous Because, as with any film sets, you don't fill out everything, you don't have the money to fill out everything.
Speaker 1:So he starts doing things outside of the ordinary to kind of test stuff, because he's like something weird is going on. So he goes into a building he doesn't normally go into and he tries to get into the elevator and it's not actually an elevator, it's an entrance to like a green room and there's like catering and so like they have to push him, push him out of there, and like he doesn't understand what's going on. So then he like smacks a guy who's like pretending to be like clearing gutters or something like that, and runs away and like all these extras are terrible improvisers, they just let him. And it's kind of like when a superhero starts testing their powers. He starts trying to figure it out. So he's like all right, I'm going to go to Fiji. Powers. He starts trying to figure it out. So he's like all right, I'm going to go to Fiji. There's a travel agent. But all the posters in the travel agency are like are you sure you want to fly? It's really dangerous. And because they didn't expect him to go to the travel agency, they have to very quickly send an actress in and she's still wearing the bib from the makeup when she comes in. She has to pull it off quickly. And so she's like wearing the bib from the makeup when she comes in, just to pull it off quickly. And so she's like I'm sorry, there are no flights for another month. And he's like all right, I'll find another way. So he tries to take a train and it's just left. And he tries to take a bus and he just manages to get on the bus and the bus driver like grinds the gears until the bus breaks because that's what he's been told to do, and everyone gets off the bus because there's a bunch of extras on the bus, including a little girl who like turns around, like is that him? And so everyone piles off the bus, nobody's upset, and the bus driver is clearly upset and he's like I'm really sorry, son.
Speaker 1:So Truman ends up having a fight with Meryl, where she's like all right, you want to go to Fiji, go to Fiji, save up for a few months and then you can go. At that point they're in his car. He's waiting in the car when she gets home from work. She's, theoretically a nurse and she rides her bike to work. He's like okay, you're okay with that, let's go now. And so he like pulls out of the driveway and starts driving, like really, really fast. She's like not okay with this, because this is not the job she signed up for. She's like freaking out.
Speaker 1:And then a bunch of cars show up and like block his way and she's like, hey, let's just go home. He's like all right. And then he backs up and goes the other direction but then skips their turn off and then goes the other way and there's a bridge off of their island and like he's afraid of the water. And there's a bridge off of their island and like he's afraid of the water and so he's like he rushes over the bridge, has her like take the wheel and he closes his eyes because he's scared of the water. And like they get over the bridge and then there's like fire that again this is Christoph clearly doing this.
Speaker 1:They get to a place where apparently there's a nuclear power plant that's having a meltdown and they have to turn around and there's police officers who are like I'm sorry, you can't come through, there's nuclear meltdown.
Speaker 1:And the police officer calls him truman and he is like this is what? And he gets out of the car and like runs away into the forest and is like tackled by several men in the like radioactive suit and the police officer and they take him home. At which point he and meryl have like another argument where he's like why do you want to have a baby with me when you don't even like me? And yeah, and she says why don't I make you a nice cup of mococo? And she does a product placement thing and he's like who are you talking to? She is like scared of him and she had recently had a product placement of like a kitchen utensil that has like it's like a knife thing and she like takes it and is like holding it towards him because she's scared. And he takes it from her and ends up like he's not actually gonna hurt her but and she like looks up and goes do something to like the christoph producers at which point marlin shows up and she's like I can, can't go on like this, it's unprofessional.
Speaker 1:Marlon comforts her and then takes Truman away and Truman's like I feel like everyone's in on it. And Marlon says to him well, if everyone were in on it then I would be in on it too. We've been best friends since we were seven years old. The only way we got through school was copying each other's work and like I would never lie to you. And then you go through and you see that Kristoff is feeding him lines. Well, you know. Meanwhile Marlon is like tearing up and it is like it's just a punch to the gut, because the one relationship that are kind of cheering Truman on, they kind of want him to figure it out.
Speaker 1:We also see Kristoff and his assistant directors working and there's an interview with Kristoff. So Marlon says and I missed one point, there was a Truman sees his father on the street dressed as a homeless man and recognizes him and everyone is telling him he's crazy and like the whole, like people, like spirit Kirk, right off the set. And so Marlon's like I found him. And there's this like emotional reunion. And so Kristoff in this interview is saying like well, since he started it. We're going to fix this. He was saying that Kirk was disgruntled and came back on. He was not happy about being written off the show, so but we're going to fix this. And the interviewer's like so how are you going to explain the 22 year absence? And he's like amnesia. The interviewer's like, oh, brilliant, even though that's so stupid. And they have some people call in to ask questions like an interview show. One of them is Sylvia saying, like what you're doing to Truman is sick. And Kristoff says, like you batted your eyelashes at him and thought you had a moment with him, but what really bothers you is that he could leave any time he wants. He doesn't appear to want to. He also says Meryl is going to be leaving the show. There will be a new love interest.
Speaker 1:So after all of that happens, we see Truman goes home, goes to sleep and we see Kristoff has this enormous screen in his like room and he goes and kind of like pets Truman's face before he goes to bed. So like he clearly has this like affection for him. So the next day Truman is back to what appears to be normal. He he is like in his like bathroom mirror and like drawing a look with soap, drawing a helmet, like he's an astronaut. He says to his neighbors his catchphrase like and if I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening, good night, goes through his normal day. Everything seems to be back to normal.
Speaker 1:They introduce who is clearly going to be the new love interest and you know, he like kind of shyly, like smiles at her and stuff like that. And in the evening his assistant directors are, you know, just kind of keeping an eye on him. He is in the basement, which is where he has been staying since Merrill left. Christoph comes in and is like what's going on? Where is he? And he's like, oh, he, just he fell asleep in the basement here. He's like something's wrong. Put on the audio. He's snoring, it's fine, he's sleeping, it's not a big deal. And so he's like send Marlon over. So Marlon comes over, comes down to the basement he's not actually there. He's piled something up and put an audio on. He's like, well, he's got to be there. We would have seen him go up the stairs.
Speaker 1:And they find that he has dug a hole from the lawn down into the basement and escaped that way. And no one realized because they didn't think that he could get out any way other than the stairs. When they find him, he has a boat that he is sailing away. And so they start, because they control the weather, they start sending storms to him. The assistant directors are like he's afraid of the water, he doesn't know how to swim, he's going to drown. And Kristoff is like no, make it worse, make it worse. And at one point Truman shouts up at the sky is that the best you can do? You're going to have to kill me? And nearly capsizes the boat until finally Kristoff says all right, that's enough, and stops. Until finally Kristoff says all right, that's enough, and stops. And so the weather improves, the boat is fine and Truman is like just kind of enjoying sailing. The boat suddenly hits something, and it's the dome, because it's not really the sea.
Speaker 1:It's this amazing, weird moment where Truman touches the sky and then he starts walking along until he comes to these stairs with the door. It's marked exit and he goes to it and then Kristoff speaks to him, which startles Truman, of course. Truman says who are you? Kristoff says I am the creator of a television show. And Truman says well then, who am I? He's like you're the star. And Kristoff tries to convince him to stay and says there are lies out there too. You know, in here you're safe, you know you can't leave. And Truman just kind of stares like up at the sky for a while and he says we'll say something. Kristoff says we'll say something. God damn it, you're on live television, you know to the entire world. And that's when Truman says and if I don't see you, good afternoon, good evening, good night. And he takes a bow and he goes out the door and we see everyone who's been watching it go like just so excited, so excited, so excited. And then one person says what else is on? And change the channel. So I remember laughing when I saw it in 1998 and I did not laugh this time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I'm going to start with something little the attention to detail in this film. It's not little, it's enormous. It's amazing the attention to detail they put into this film. But it's not a big part of my analysis. So there are things that they thought about and put into that I just think are amazing. So, for instance, this is a dome. There is no real sunlight, truman would not get any actual vitamin D, and so they've thought of that. And you see, in one scene he has a bottle of vitamin D pills by his breakfast. So there are moments like that that they have thought of. That kind of attention to detail is amazing.
Speaker 1:So Peter Weir and Andrew Nicol thought through the implications of what this would be and included it in the film. They have given us all of these details of what it would be like to enclose someone in a space like this. The fact that the music that he listens to is classical Clive, it's classical music because that's in the public domain. So that is partially because that's money-saving, but then it also helps them control the narrative as well, because if they were to allow him to listen to contemporary music with contemporary lyrics, that could give him more opportunities to question things. So, like, all of these kinds of attention to detail is just amazing, it's when he stops by the newsstand every day and picks up a newspaper and a magazine.
Speaker 1:The magazines that are there are all things that that are hobbies that don't require travel. So there's dog fancier, there's parenting magazines, there's fashion magazines All of this stuff is just really impressive. There's also a street cleaner who has one of those grabby things to pick things up off the street. He's not actually picking anything up because he's an actor, he's not actually a street cleaner and like this place is pristine, because it's not actually a place where people are on the street. And then the fact that these extras aren't actually citizens doing things. They're pretending and so they're not very good at it. So all of these little details are phenomenal and really, really well done. That attention to detail is amazing. It's an amazing aspect of this film that rewards repeat viewing and I think is also just a testament to how good this movie is. I just kind of wanted to mention that before I jump into the bigger analysis.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cool. All right, there's some potatoes, give me some meat.
Speaker 1:So allegory for high-control religion, because this is something I didn't quite get, and it's also an allegory for abusive relationships too. So in the most generous reading of this, christoph truly does love Truman. I have trouble seeing that because his love is control. He loves Truman as long as Truman does what he wants within the dome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, very conditional love, and that love means gaslighting him. It means asking myriad other people to gaslight him. So like thinking about the bus driver who really was upset about it and you know, on the one hand you could be like so why does he work for him? And it's like, well, you're an actor. It's not like there's a lot of options out there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, jobs are hard to come by.
Speaker 1:And like if you're an extra on something like that, you don't think you're going to have to actually do that. Right, Like the little girl who was like is that him? Yeah, so, especially if you're extra and your job is to be the bus driver, you're like he doesn't leave.
Speaker 2:Right and he doesn't drive the bus. He doesn't ride the bus, he has his own car.
Speaker 1:Kristoff does that. And then I saw something last night and there are several YouTube videos I'm going to link in the show notes that talked about how, in a lot of ways, marlon is a big victim in this too, in part because he was seven years old when he was brought into this, and Truman is truly his friend, even though he is in on this conspiracy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so he's forced to abuse his friend from age seven.
Speaker 1:And so he didn't have a chance to consent to this either, which is also really like a good example of what it's like to be in a high-control religion.
Speaker 1:Right, the indoctrination starts really young and that's the internalized oppression, so that even when the big guy's not here, like we police each other so there's that societal pressure that christoph, so like the prophet or no one, is getting through to Truman, even as he's like, asking, like tell me what's going on. And that is it's heartbreaking. It is heartbreaking especially so truman doesn't know anyone who is real, and it's fitting that his name is truman. Everyone else is going by a fake name and so, and so the other aspect of it, the thing that I have many of the apostates, the ex-evangelicals that I've read have talked about is they have a touching the wall moment, or touching the edge of the dome moment, when they have decided to leave their faith. Faith and how it's exhilarating and scary where they have long suspected that their faith is not what they've been told it was. But they didn't necessarily have proof. And just as Truman has long believed that there is some sort of grand conspiracy, this world is not what he thinks it is, but he didn't necessarily have proof. But when the boat hits the wall and he actually reaches out and his hands trembling a little bit and he touches the wall, that's proof. It's proof that this world is not what he's been told it is, and how terrifying that is.
Speaker 1:Christoph has this illusion of control. So one of the like, one of the moments that stuck with me from when I was 19. They are searching for truman overnight, like they have all the actors and extras like linking arms. They're searching all of sea Haven before they realize that he's taken a boat and he's on the sea. It's overnight and he's like we're not going to be able to find him. It's too dark and he's like cue the sun.
Speaker 1:It is very clear that Kristoff sees himself as this god of this little fiefdom. Yeah, he says he's the creator. Control is an illusion Because when Christoph is talking to Truman, he says I know you better than you know yourself. I watched when you were born, I watched when you took your first steps. I watched the episode when you lost your first tooth, and he says it that way the episode when you lost your first tooth, and he says it that way the episode. And Truman says you never had cameras in my head. And that is, I think, something that's really important is, like, any time there is an attempt to control anything, it's an illusion Because we do have. We humans have free will and the world is chaotic. The attempts to manipulate and control Truman, to imprison him there, can't and won't work because they never had cameras in his head.
Speaker 2:They never knew who he was inside, because it's an illusion of control friend and teacher, rabbi david jaffe, says they can hack our brains, but they can't hack our souls.
Speaker 1:That's what's coming up for me right now and watching this, I was reminded very much of the matrix, which just came out a year later yeah, because it's the conversation between neo and morpheus, where you know neo is saying like, yeah, with this world, so he gets to leave.
Speaker 1:And it's Plato's allegory of the cave, which is the only world you've ever known. Is this cave where you see shadows and you think it's the only world there is. But when you leave the cave and you see the world as it is, it's terrifying because it's different, but it is so much bigger and brighter. I think it is very fitting and shows how much personal, like you know, delusion control. You don't have control over anything but yourself, your soul. That truman ends the show with his catchphrase and a bow which is like the most classy middle finger he could possibly give.
Speaker 2:Be like you wanted a performer, I'm done performing yeah, speaking of performers and not you mentioned that there are those who say that this was sort of prescient of reality tv like survivor and whatever, but that maybe that misses the point. That comparison misses the point. Can Can you say more about?
Speaker 1:that, yeah, so like there's, and I definitely understand why that analysis was so prevalent.
Speaker 2:Well, the cameras everywhere is an obvious, that's the obvious connection.
Speaker 1:And I don't think that it's an unreasonable connection. It's just that's not what's disturbing about this film, Like the fact that he's under constant surveillance is not what's disturbing Constant and unrealized surveillance. Yeah, that his life as a performance is not what's disturbing.
Speaker 2:What's disturbing, it's not what's most disturbing. It's kind of disturbing.
Speaker 1:Gotcha there. What I took away from this was not the cameras and all of that, it was the gaslighting, the manipulation, kristoff's narcissism, the lack of choice, the lack of consent of choice, the lack of consent. That is what left me feeling cold about this film. I mean not cold about this film, the film's brilliant. It's what let me feel cold about what Kristoff did.
Speaker 1:The methodology that Kristoff used to do it is not good, but this film could have like the story. He could have done the same thing using a different method and it would have told a similar story. It just happened to use reality television as the particular medium and that's why I say I feel like talking about it being prescient, about reality TV, misses the point, because this is a story about someone playing God and it's a story about control that the abusive controlling person thinks is love, and that, I think, is the point of the story, not the cameras well, I think too, because the thing that's interesting not to me but in general about reality tv is that all of the players know there are cameras and then forget.
Speaker 2:And so watching to see when the performance stops or the performance for the camera stops and the sort of authenticity or, you know, authentic pettiness for the contest shows up, I don't find that interesting. I like to see people at their best, not at their worst, but I think that's what's interesting to the viewer. But the fact that the players all knew the cameras were there from the beginning is part of the interest, I think, because seeing when they forget is like what we're watching for. So Truman is the opposite right. Truman never knows the cameras are there and so the setting is similar insofar as there are cameras everywhere, but the actual action and what is in it for the viewers is different that Christophe displays.
Speaker 1:He says to Sylvia your concern is that he could leave anytime you want, and he doesn't. But he can't. Because when he tries to Christophe nearly kills him and at one point one of the studio executives says you can't have him die on live television. Executive says you can't have him die on live television.
Speaker 2:And Kristoff's response is well, he was born on live television and because his commitment to the spectacle and the show is greater than his commitment to the well-being of this person, he claims to care about this person he claims to care about, and again, that is to me bigger than the fact of the cameras and that speaks to something that I don't know if you've said yet and we're running out of time, but I just want to name, like we said, that the love was conditional, and the condition actually, if we zoom out, is on the money-making ability, right, like it's actually all of, like Truman is a meal ticket for Kristoff and he has to keep him in the dome in order to keep that money flowing, and so all those product placements that are so awkward, you know where Truman's like who are you talking to?
Speaker 2:Or like gets pushed against the wall or whatever by acquaintances so that the shot is right, like those moments like that's what's driving Kristoff. And so the condition is not just like how you treat me, which is the way sort of narcissistic, conditional love often manifests, it's like how you keep making me money.
Speaker 1:Well, it's the ultimate stage, parent, it's an extra layer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah it's the ultimate stage, parent, which is an extra layer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Something to that there as well. So you see all of these people watching and they are delighted that Truman escapes, even though they are fans of the show, even though they love Truman, even though it means the end of something they enjoy, even though they love Truman, even though it means the end of something they enjoy.
Speaker 1:And I was thinking about that, and I was thinking like some of that has to do with the fact that stories are supposed to end and like one of the things that I lament about American television is that they will squeeze every drop out of it even long past when the show should have just wrapped up same, but yeah story same with like they'll keep churning out sequels, even when like the juice is gone, right, right I was thinking about that too where it's like that's not even necessarily like truman getting out, isn't even exactly about them like cheering on this person. It's more about like oh, this is a satisfying conclusion.
Speaker 2:I think that's part of it. I think there's also potentially some commentary about the authenticity of a parasocial relationship, Like there is some authentic care even in a parasocial relationship. It's not reciprocal, obviously, but from the audience, like there is genuine care for that person that we're watching on the screen, except that the last line is what else is on? Yeah, yeah. Well, that speaks to the story. It was a satisfying conclusion. Now it's over and just that.
Speaker 1:That is where, like the prescience of, of reality tv, that like everything's a product and we're just, it's just a constant stream of content.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we just consume it and then move on. Yeah, yeah, we are pretty much out of time, so any like final insights before I do my wrap up so there's a lot of focus on like this is an allegory for high control religion.
Speaker 1:I was also spending a little time thinking about the aspects of Judaism that I struggle with, specifically the story of the binding of Isaac, where God tells Abraham to take Isaac and sacrifice him, sacrifice him and really you're Okay.
Speaker 1:Really you're bringing this up now. Yeah, we got three minutes left, so I was thinking about that because I struggle with that so much, and that feels like the kind of request that a Christoph-type God would ask of a Truman-type Abraham, except it wouldn't be Truman, it would be Marlin. Yes, yeah, it would be Marlin of Truman. Yeah, thinking about where and like I don't have any answers to it, which is part of the reason why I'm bringing it up at the end, where it's just like I just want to put this in there and just think about it when we see echoes in media like this, where it feels like we're in a dome being asked to do impossible things, horrible things.
Speaker 2:I mean, there's a lot of commentary on the Akedah in particular, that story in particular, many of which suggest that God actually did it, so that Abraham would say no, I'm not doing this. And others would say Abraham was testing God to see if God would actually like go through it with it, and neither of them intended to. But that's a. That's a different thing.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know. And I oh, I know, and, like the thing is, I don't find either of those satisfying. That's why it reminded me of that. But I was just thinking like people who have left high control religions feel like this is a good metaphor for their experience. But I do not feel like I'm a member of a high control religion, but I still see echoes in a religion that I feel very comfortable being a part of.
Speaker 2:So yeah, in the stories.
Speaker 1:Nobody's asking you, no one is asking me to bind my child, but what I'm saying is even in religion that feels pretty progressive and open, there are still stories, there are still moments that can feel like this and that's worth thinking about. That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 2:I'm going to give some highlights from some key takeaways from what I just what we just talked about. Ok, so I'll start with where we ended, which is that this film is an allegory that ex-evangelicals so people who have escaped high control evangelical religions see themselves in this movie in the way the control that is exerted over Truman. And you're noting that even in non-high-control religions, like the sort of non-Orthodox Judaism that you and I practice, there are echoes at least in the stories, if not in what we're being asked to do, and that's worth thinking about that. This movie has an allegory of religion and escape from religion and the implications of that, with the narcissism of christoph who is the creator of the cv show, are sort of interesting in terms of like some of those stories and then also the actual churches where a leader is narcissistic. And then you pointed out this is really interesting the ways in which the gaslighting that is required of this control of the object of control, the gaslighting of them and the participation in the gaslighting of everyone around them and the damage that that does to other people. You spent some time pointing out, in particular, the damage, the victimhood of Marlon, the best friend, who was recruited into this when he was seven years old, so literally grew up lying to his friend, and that's the only, that's the basis of their relationship and the only relationship that they have, and how just sad and damaging that is. You noted that this sort of escape metaphor is reminiscent of Plato's allegory of the cave and that if all you know is the cave and the shadows on the cave, then you think that's all there is. And then you actually go outside and it is wonderful and terrifying when you see how much bigger and brighter and more depth there is to the world outside the cave. You also talked about sort of there's a lot about control in this movie, and so you noted that all control in this movie and otherwise is an illusion, because in the pithy quote of my teacher and friend, rabbi Jaffe, they can hack our brains but they can't hack our souls. So Christoph thinks he knows Truman better than Truman knows himself, but there are no cameras in Truman's head and so when Truman starts to think for himself, things change about capitalism in this film and sort of the nods to capitalism with the product placements, but also the fact that Kristoff's love of Truman is completely conditional, and not just conditional on the way that Truman treats Kristoff, which is sort of a traditional narcissistic conditional love, but conditional on him continuing to be the cash cow of the star of this TV show, of the star of this TV show.
Speaker 2:Many people call this film prescient of later reality TV, which in some ways it is, because the setting is very similar, with cameras everywhere, including in your bathroom mirror. But the actual heart, the meat of what's happening, of the lessons that we are meant to draw, is totally different, because reality TV stars know the cameras are there and sometimes they forget, but they know from the beginning that they're there and they consent to do this, and Truman did not. And so the actual lessons that we're learning are different. And then the last thing, which was the first thing you started with, was the remarkable attention to detail that the filmmakers had for this film. So the example you gave was he's in a geodesic dome without actual sunlight, so they put vitamin D next to him. That repeat viewing will reveal various things like that that are attention to detail, like the actress who has to come in and still has the makeup bib on, or other things that remind us that all of this is a fiction inside a fiction, because we're watching a movie. Any final words?
Speaker 1:Just that. I think that this movie gets to a human condition, even though it's about something completely fantastical.
Speaker 2:Yeah, nice. Well, next week I am going to bring you my deep thoughts about romancing the stone, thanks to a listener suggestion.
Speaker 2:So fancy me Very cool. See you, then. This show is a labor of love, but that doesn't make it free to produce. If you enjoy it even half as much as we do, please consider helping to keep us overthinking. You can support us at our Patreon there's a link in the show notes or leave a positive review so others can find us and, of course, share the show with your people. Thanks for listening. Our theme music is Professor Umlaut by Kevin MacLeod from Incompetechcom. Find full music credits in the show notes. Thank you to Resonate Recordings for editing today's episode. Until next time, remember pop culture is still culture, and shouldn't you know what's in your head?